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All good inquisitions are in Spanish ...

Bill


On 9/11/2011 7:54 AM, Charles Butler wrote:
> As I have stated before, the placement of the thumb on more than 30 of 
> the handshapes seems arbitrary and confusing. I look at my hand and it 
> does not match the signwriting shape.
>
> The thumb is on the wrong side from looking at it. The drawings don't 
> try to put the little finger on the wrong side, why do you do that 
> with the thumb? '
>
> I'm supposed to teach this when my own students will ask the same 
> question. But teacher, if I lay my hand down on the drawing, it 
> doesn't match. Are my students blind?
>
> And on some of them the index finger which clearly shifts sides of the 
> palm is rigid as if I can't count fingers and look at the edge of my 
> palm and see which side of an icon it ought to be on.
>
> If I cannot look at my hand, and lay it down on the icon and see which 
> side is up or down, then the system really needs to be looked at 
> again. When this system was created, we did not debate it. We taught 
> "look at your hand" and "write what you see".  That is not here now.
>
> Black and white are palm facings and fingers must be on the side they 
> actually are on, not one shape, without rotation for the same hand. 
> The hand mirrors, why not the icon? I want an answer that makes actual 
> literal sense. Show me how my thumb does not move?
>
> The C hand in particular makes no sense. The same icon for both the 
> front and the back of the same hand when the thumb clearly moves is 
> truly odd. How can a mirror image NOT be a mirror image?
>
> The rule of "point to the center" when the thumb just isn't there is 
> not what I learned when the system was created, and now ALL of those 
> old drawings, including a lot of what I edited in Brazil are wrong? I 
> don't think so.
>
> It is a triumph to get all of the icons in a graphic volume, but there 
> is clearly something odd going on here.
>
> Charles Butler
>
>
> --- On *Mon, 9/5/11, Valerie Sutton /<[log in to unmask]>/* wrote:
>
>
>     From: Valerie Sutton <[log in to unmask]>
>     Subject: Re: NEW: SignWriting Hand Symbols Manual completed!
>     To: [log in to unmask]
>     Date: Monday, September 5, 2011, 9:03 AM
>
>     SignWriting List
>     September 5, 2011
>
>     On Sep 4, 2011, at 6:33 PM, Alan Post wrote:
>>     Yay!  I've been waiting for this.  My order is placed! -Alan
>
>     ---------
>
>     Thank you for our first order for our new book, Alan!
>
>     Adam Frost and I worked on this book for several years. The first
>     four chapters were on the web for download in the past year. But
>     the book was not finished until a week ago...
>
>     Finally we have photos and symbols of 6 palm facings for all 261
>     hand symbols of the ISWA 2010 documented in a book...Thanks to
>     Adam's patience with taking photos of his own hands, and then
>     enlarging the symbols. I wrote the instruction sections, but Adam
>     provided the photos of himself for the instruction sections. I did
>     the book layout and design, but without Adam's improved graphics
>     of the enlarged symbols we would not have a book...so this was a
>     true co-authorship....
>
>     Thank you, Adam, for your hard work.....I truly enjoyed working
>     with you on this big project...
>
>     And Alan...your copy will be in the postal mail tomorrow - smile- -
>
>     Val ;-)
>
>
>
>     ----------------------
>
>
>     On Sep 4, 2011, at 3:10 PM, Valerie Sutton wrote:
>
>>     SignWriting List
>>     September 4, 2011
>>
>>     ANNOUNCING!
>>
>>
>>     *SignWriting Hand Symbols Manual*
>>     by Valerie Sutton and Adam Frost
>>
>>     The SignWriting Hand Symbols Manual is a thick 300 page,
>>     paperback, spiral bound book that devotes a full page to each of
>>     the 261 hand symbols of the International SignWriting Alphabet
>>     (ISWA 2010), used to write over 40 sign languages.
>>
>>     Each page shows one handshape with 6 photos showing 6 different
>>     palm facings. The corresponding SignWriting symbol is placed next
>>     to each photo. Additional SignWriting instruction is included in
>>     the front and the back of the book.
>>
>>     Useful for beginning and advanced SignWriting students, sign
>>     language linguists, teachers and researchers.
>>
>>     Now available for download online:
>>
>>     Go to:
>>     *SignWriting Lessons*
>>     http://www.signwriting.org/lessons
>>
>>     and available for purchase online:
>>
>>     Go to:
>>     *SignWriting Shop*
>>     http://www.signwriting.org/shop
>>     http://www.suttonshop.com/ecommerce/pages/products_sw_detail.jsp?id=69.0
>>
>>
>>     Val ;-)
>>
>>     Valerie Sutton
>>     SignWriting List moderator
>>     [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
>>
>>     Post Messages to the SignWriting List:
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>>
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>