Hi Valerie,
thank you so much for
your interesting and well explained comment.
I am so sorry to disturb
anybody with my graphic I simply created with the options I can take out of the
signpuddle signmaker. I have to realize that you concentrate on my mistake to
create a graphic that looks like as if some fingers look taller or longer ... or
as if there is more or less space...
Perhaps an example – just
handwriting – would sgow much better what is on my mind to ask this question,
Excuse – the length of
the fingers or the space between the fingers is not the point and perhaps the
design-experts would be able to present perfectly polished well measured
fingers... ;-) ...
What I try to figure out
is just the issue – whether there is a basic difference between this or that
writing (design) of the bent fingers ( curves or square) strokes.
Personally I prefer the
status as it is and personally I feel much more comfortabel to “read” the bent
finger with square ...
But since we discuss this
in our group I thought it might be a good idea to discuss this on a higher
level. That is the reason to poste this question here.
Perhaps Jo or Jörn from
the delegs-team can motivate people from the design – team to show some of
their suggestions or options how they would prefer to write these hand shapes
with bent finger in a much better style compared to what I created with
signmaker .... smile!
Thanks a again for your
kind and supportive comment. Between the lines anybody can understand that you
try to support anybody who is eager to put engergy into any project related to
your ingenious invention.
All best Stefan
Von: SignWriting
List: Read and Write Sign Languages [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Im Auftrag von Valerie Sutton
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 14. Februar
2013 05:46
An:
[log in to unmask]
Betreff: Re: discussion: design of
bent fingers
SignWriting List
What do I think? Thanks for asking ;-) Actually I am not sure what I
think - ha! This is not something I can just answer yes or no to…It would take
me some time to study the old hand symbols from years ago, and our current ISWA
2010 to see what was and what is now…but no matter what, if your team makes the
change, it changes the ISWA 2010 for several reasons…first the fingers in the
new handshape are higher than the fingers in the current ISWA 2010 hand
symbol…so just that alone would make it hard to replace one with the other in
the middle of signs already written - you know how we place fingers very
carefully, for example on the face, and if the fingers suddenly are taller or
longer, then the replacement would be a problem and the signs would have to be re-written
- so be careful that any changes you make are not different in size.
Also, there is more space between the two fingers in the new symbol,
which is not really correct - The idea behind the original symbol is that the
two fingers are close to each other like a bent U, but they do not look close
to each other in the new symbol - although maybe you can improve that ;-)
I do not understand exactly what you are doing with Font Design - We
have font development going on here too, related to the SVG we already have,
and we are working with a form of TrueType to place the ISWA 2010 into TrueType
- meanwhile - I think your work is wonderful with so many new software
developments so it is all good - It is just a matter of knowing what the goal
is…
Here is the way I look at it…
Think of the current ISWA 2010 as the "current alphabet"… A
Font Design of A, B, C can have a slightly different look to it, but it cannot
be so hard to read that you can no longer read the words…and the newly designed
fonts have to have symbols that fit inside the spacing of the current words
already written -
Regarding the idea of curved or bent…there is a slight difference in
performance of the handshape, but it is such a slight difference that most
people would not be able to actually physically perform the difference, but
there is a feeling to it perhaps when reading it - I am not sure about that
though - just a thought -
So I have to leave this to you - maybe you can show us more later and
it will become clearer for all of us - I appreciate it very much that you asked
us -
And keep us informed on the List about all you are doing -
Please send my best to your team -
Hi Charles, Valerie and
sw-list members,
Perhaps this sign can
explain better what is on my mind - the two hands move inwards –
startposition U-hand a little bit curved – in the endposition the two fingers
are really bent as much as possible –
I know and I understand
that the symbol with the bent square fingers has been accepted and is established in order to
indicate this clearly.
Our Font- design team would love to write this instead
with the curved lines as you can see on the left...
Would this be correct? Is there inany way
a kind of violation of principles? Is this a matter of artwork?
[log in to unmask]" apple-width=yes apple-height=yes>
Von: SignWriting
List: Read and Write Sign Languages [mailto:SW-[log in to unmask]] Im
Auftrag von Stefan
Wöhrmann
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 14. Februar 2013 00:24
An: [log in to unmask]
Betreff: AW: discussion: design of bent fingers
please let me explain
again – I am not discussing different signs. I am not discussing that it
is possible to bent the fingers just a little bit or extremely. I would like to
discuss
the possibility to write
the bent index as a bent sqare finger or as a half –circle curve.
See the sign below. Looking at the left or right hand there should not be any
difference – well perhaps except for the “feeling” – smile
[log in to unmask]"
apple-width=yes apple-height=yes>
If you bent your fingers
– you can write this as bent square fingers. (We find this for handshapes with
one, two or three fingers) We do not find this for 4 or 5 fingers –
Well the fingers bent the same way but the design of
that given handshape shows smooth lines instead of “bent square fingers”
Is this because of a design – problem with old
software or is there an idea behind this concept.
I fully agree with your last statement
“ "beautiful" artwork must make sure that you don't
lose articulation. “ That is the reason that I ask for your opinion
smile!
Hi Valerie – what do you
think ?
Von: SignWriting
List: Read and Write Sign Languages [mailto:SW-[log in to unmask]] Im
Auftrag von Charles
Butler
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 13. Februar 2013 23:12
An: [log in to unmask]
Betreff: Re: discussion: design of bent fingers
|
From: Stefan Wöhrmann <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: discussion: design of bent fingers
To: [log in to unmask]
Date: Wednesday, February 13, 2013, 4:58 PM
Hi Valerie and sw-friends,
I would like to ask for your
comments about the following issue.
Within our delegs-projekt a group
of specialized design-students have a second look at the various SW-symbols.
From their point of view there are options to “improve” the design of some
symbols in order to make the whole SW-symbol-font look more “modern” or “nice”
While preparing some studies of
the ongoing process they showed up with the question whether the bent index
can be written with smooth curves as well showing the index finger bent as
you designed it as a finger with sharp edges.
[log in to unmask]" apple-width=yes apple-height=yes>
I played around with the signmaker
to create a little demo of what I am talking about. ;-))
Interesting question – so I looked
carefully at the Symbolset and discovered that the “claw hand” is
designed exactly this way (rounded lines for the fingers)
On the other hand the hands with
only one, two or at least three fingers show this other design with sharp 90°
angles.
Can you tell us: Is this a matter
of history? Coming from the old “DOS-SW-Software – we could not write nice
circles either. You know this “old symbol” just indicating that you are
supposed to see a circle-movement shown as some dots in a circle.
What about this difference between
a clawhand with curves or the same hand written with edges?
[log in to unmask]" apple-width=yes apple-height=yes>
Is there any meaningful difference
in the background that you would want us to know? Or is this a
matter of artwork? ... or something else?
Would it be any difference if we
would write all these bent fingers with soft rounded lines?
Thank you very much for your
attention.
All best
Stefan
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