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Stefan, when I get the time I will look in my video data corpus to see if I can find instances of signers performing the sign as you suggest they might. (love the images you included!!!)


On Fri, Mar 29, 2013 at 3:13 PM, Stefan Wöhrmann <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi Maria, Erika,Adam, Valerie...

 

The reason that I feel uncomfortable with the spelling of this sign is just as Erika explains:

 

“Maybe it's because the wrist of the right hand has to flex so much to allow  the hand to rest in the palm of the left? “

 

That`s it and it is independent of DGS – smile.

 

 

Reading your sign my brain suggests to experiment with one of these variations:

 

Left hand indicating the ground, right hand indicating the tower (Dharahara)   -

 

 

(I would feel much more comfortable with the left hand palm down ( but that is not the point. It is not up to me to discuss signs but only to discuss spelling – I know smile!)

 

 

 

 

Well if you write a “rest” one hand upon another I expect that I can perform that. In this case you cannot unless you rest the lower arm on the palm of the left hand holding the right hand at 90°.

(That hurts)

 

 

 

What we do in these cases is what Adam explained: We simply accept and tell our brain to interpret this spelling if it shows up another time to be interpreted as what you see on Erikas foto.

 

I myself love to discuss spelling and to ask myself wether this or that spelling should be chosen.

 

Sometimes I have my doubts immediately – for example when reading the first attempt of Claudia to write Paris – wow next message she shows up to change handorientation – well done!! Another example is the spelling of Sao Paulo palm facing the signer...

 

 

In this case of Kathmandu – Adam is right – it hurts if I try to sign it with this extreme bend  and I would be eager to videotape 10 signers in Kathmandu – how many of them would rest the back of the right hand on the palm of the left hand – but just bending the index up – or something like this in between the two spellings ;-)

 

So to anwer your question Maria – in my first contact with Erikas spelling  I wanted the right hand with index straight upward... and that is impossible.

 

Thanks Maria for your question.

 

 

Stefan

 

 

 


Von: SignWriting List: Read and Write Sign Languages [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Im Auftrag von Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway
Gesendet: Freitag, 29. März 2013 18:25
An: [log in to unmask]
Betreff: Re: Erika's SignWriting..

 

Stefan - would that have helped?

Happy Easter to you too Maria! I was actually just eating a Cadbury Cream Egg while reading your message...

 

On Fri, Mar 29, 2013 at 1:13 PM, MARIA GALEA <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Yes that could be it..perhaps if the B-Hand hand is written diagonally it
might read more 'smoothly'? see attached.

oh and before I go a BIG HAPPY EASTER Erika and EVERYONE else on the
List..enjoy your Easter Eggs and naturally your loved ones.
maria




> Maybe it's because the wrist of the right hand has to flex so much to
> allow
> the hand to rest in the palm of the left? Maybe that extreme bend is not
> as
> phonologically common in, say, DGS?
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 29, 2013 at 12:51 PM, MARIA GALEA
> <[log in to unmask]>wrote:
>
>> Stefan,
>> I could read Erika's writing perfectly, without the photo. I don't
>> understand why you claimed that the SignWriting couldn't be performed.
>> Maria
>>
>>
>> > Here's a photo of the sign. How would you suggest I write it. Scribing
>> has
>> > never been my strong suit :)
>> >
>> > On Thu, Mar 28, 2013 at 4:01 PM, Stefan W�hrmann <
>> > [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> >
>> >>  Hi Erika, ****
>> >>
>> >> ** **
>> >>
>> >> well I cannot perform that ;-(  although I have an idea what you want
>> to
>> >> show � but right hand up there is the horizontal line of hand and
>> lower
>> >> arm  - nothing that can be rest on the left palm ???****
>> >>
>> >> ** **
>> >>
>> >> Stefan****
>> >>
>> >> ** **
>> >>  ------------------------------
>> >>
>> >> *Von:* SignWriting List: Read and Write Sign Languages [mailto:
>> >> [log in to unmask]] *Im Auftrag von *Erika
>> >> Hoffmann-Dilloway
>> >> *Gesendet:* Donnerstag, 28. M�rz 2013 18:07
>> >>
>> >> *An:* [log in to unmask]
>> >> *Betreff:* Re: Signs for Cities and States - can you write the name
>> of
>> >> YOUR city and post to the List?
>> >> ****
>> >>
>> >>  ** **
>> >>
>> >> Yes, the right hand comes to rest on top of the palm of the left.
>> Maybe
>> >> I
>> >> should just have shown them already in contact?****
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Mar 28, 2013 at 12:47 PM, Stefan W�hrmann <
>> >> [log in to unmask]> wrote:****
>> >>
>> >> Hi Erika, ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> can you explain Kathmandu: ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> left flat hand palm up fingers to the right ( no problem)****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> right hand Index � Hand � palm facing the signer  moving down  - mh
>> �
>> >>  how to get the touch between the two hands � right hand on top of
>> the
>> >> left
>> >> hand ?? ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> Stefan ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>  ------------------------------
>> >>
>> >> *Von:* SignWriting List: Read and Write Sign Languages [mailto:
>> >> [log in to unmask]] *Im Auftrag von *Erika
>> >> Hoffmann-Dilloway
>> >> *Gesendet:* Donnerstag, 28. M�rz 2013 17:18****
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> *An:* [log in to unmask]
>> >> *Betreff:* Re: Signs for Cities and States - can you write the name
>> of
>> >> YOUR city and post to the List?****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> I don't know ASL, so I don't know a sign for Detroit, Ann Arbor, or
>> >> Oberlin (my US places).****
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> So I'm posting the sign for Kathmandu, the city where I learned to
>> sign!
>> >> *
>> >> ***
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Mar 28, 2013 at 12:03 PM, Adam Frost <[log in to unmask]>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> ****
>> >>
>> >> I am a West Coaster, and I must admit that people get East Coast city
>> >> signs mixed up along with our own city signs. But this is how I
>> >> personally
>> >> sign the 4 commonly confused "B" cities, since I am very picky and
>> have
>> >> been known to correct people at times. ;-) It seems to match what you
>> >> sign,
>> >> Kim.****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> ****
>> >>
>> >> Boston, Massachusetts****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> ****
>> >>
>> >> Baltimore, Massachusetts****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> ****
>> >>
>> >> Berkeley, California****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> ****
>> >>
>> >> Burbank, California****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> Adam****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> On Mar 28, 2013, at 8:23 AM, Kimberley Shaw wrote:****
>> >>
>> >> ** **
>> >>
>> >> Hi everyone:
>> >> those of us in Boston, Massachusetts sign it thus:
>> >> ****
>> >>  ------------------------------
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >>  and refer to Berkeley, CA thus:
>> >>
>> >> But some of my signing friends tell me that when you're on the West
>> >> Coast,
>> >> it's the other way around!
>> >> Best,
>> >> Kim from Boston****
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Mar 28, 2013 at 10:02 AM, Valerie Sutton
>> <[log in to unmask]>
>> >> wrote:****
>> >>
>> >> SignWriting List****
>> >>
>> >> March 28, 2013****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> NAMES OF CITIES and STATES Around the World****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> Thank you, Ingvild, Charles and Stefan for your signs!****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> I would suggest that you add your signs to the International Sign
>> >> Dictionary online:****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> SignPuddle for International Signs Dictionary****
>> >>
>> >> http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle2.0/index.php?ui=1&sgn=35****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> I just copied mine for La Jolla, California from the ASL Dictionary
>> to
>> >> the
>> >> International Dictionary, and I hope you can do the same for your
>> signs
>> >> too�
>> >> ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> And I hope more names of cities, states, countries and other
>> >> international
>> >> signs can be added too�****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> Here is what we have so far�and I really like all four spellings!
>> Thanks
>> >> to you all�****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> Val ;-)****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >> ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >>  ****
>> >>
>> >>   ****
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway
>> >> Assistant Professor of Anthropology
>> >> Oberlin College ****
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway
>> >> Assistant Professor of Anthropology
>> >> Oberlin College ****
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway
>> > Assistant Professor of Anthropology
>> > Oberlin College
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway
> Assistant Professor of Anthropology
> Oberlin College
>




--
Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway
Assistant Professor of Anthropology
Oberlin College




--
Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway
Assistant Professor of Anthropology
Oberlin College