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SignWriting List
October 4, 2013

Hello André and Jonathan -
I believe that Andre mentioned SignBank 8.5, because years ago I developed a database that was specially designed for SignWriting called "SignBank" and it was developed in FileMaker Pro, which is database software for both the Mac and Windows. SignBank went through many improvements and although it is out-of-date now, has potential to be improved again to match our current world. To read more about the old SignBank, here is information:

SignBank in FileMaker Pro
http://www.signbank.org/signbank.html

SignBank 8.5 was never updated to use the ISWA 2010. So without that update it would not be possible for us to import and export between SignWriter Studio or SignPuddle.

Now, Andre - Jonathan has brought up two great points …First he will be building a new feature into SignWriter Studio to print dictionaries to PDF someday…and Second, if you were to use the PersonalPuddle, which is desktop SignPuddle software, SignWriter Studio coordinates well with the PersonalPuddle -

PersonalPuddle
http://www.suttonshop.com/ecommerce/pages/products_sw_detail.jsp?id=60.0

Val ;-)

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On Oct 4, 2013, at 7:58 AM, Jonathan Duncan <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hello André,
    What do you mean by "I tried sign bank 85 but I could never upload the Québec Sign language files I copied from Sign puddle".  I was thinking that maybe you mean't the signpuddle number of the puddle where in the url sgn=85, but that is India's signpuddle.  The  for "Dictionnaire Quebec" is sgn=47.

    I imagine you mean that you downloaded the puddle from SignPuddle and couldn't import it.  Is this what you meant?

I just imported it and it worked fine for me.  Let me know where you are getting stuck.

If you meant uploading to SignPuddle then the bad news it that SignPuddle can only import one sign or document at a time.

Exporting from SignWriter Studio to PersonalPuddle  and vice versa is much more feasible though not perfect.


Jonathan

On 10/2/2013 6:20 PM, André L wrote:
[log in to unmask]" type="cite">

Hello Jonathan,
 
thank you for the work around.
I will try it this weekend.
I will try to contact Steve to assist me because I have over a hundred signs to process.
I have many more signs in draft in SignWriter studio.
 
Also, I tried sign bank 85 but I could never upload the Québec Sign language files I copied from Sign puddle, so I gave up.   I would have like to build a dictionnary.
 
 
André Lemyre

Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2013 16:29:30 -0600
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Sign puddle online does not translate existing words
To: [log in to unmask]

Hi Andre,
   When exporting from SignWriter Studio to Sign Puddle there is no way to directly to a SignMaker entry. This is a limitation of SignPuddle. I have run into this limitation myself personally trying to add and modify sign to the puddle from SignWriter Studio.  SignPuddle doesn't yet have adequate import/export or synching capabilities.   I have written to Steve about it but he hasn't been able to make it a priority yet.
If you just have a few signs then this is they way to do it.
  1. In SignWriter Studio when positioned on the sign, click Edit/Copy/Copy Sign to Sign Puddle or press Ctrl-Alt-C.  It shows the sign in SignPuddle in your browser.
  2. Click on the puddle you want to save to.
  3. In Terms type "temp"
  4. Click Add
  5. Click Copy Sign From SignText
  6. Click Copy Sign
  7. Click on SignPuddle you want to save to
  8. In Terms type in the term for the sign
  9. Click Add
  10. Click on Search by Words or Search by Signs
  11. In Terms and Titles type "temp"
  12. Click on temp
  13. Click Delete Entry
  14. Click Delete Entry


Otherwise you might ask Steve if you export to an SPML file if he can add them for you.

I hope his helps

Regards,
Jonathan

On 10/2/2013 11:41 AM, Valerie Sutton wrote:
[log in to unmask]"> SignWriting List
October 2, 2013

Andre, Steve, Charles and Jonathan -

No worries everyone. Thank you for your messages. And thank you for bringing this issue up, which as far as I know, from my experience, is specific between the two programs: SignWriter Studio and SignPuddle. I noticed this issue myself a long time ago and did mention it once to Jonathan, but there is so much to do it got sidetracked. It seems that exporting signs from the SignWriter Studio dictionary end up as SignText in SignPuddle instead of dictionary entries…so the signs are not made with SignMaker, but instead with SignWriter Studio's dictionary, but they need to end up as the equivalent to signs made with SignMaker… not as SignText …so we need both Jonathan's and Steve's help with this one -

Thank you, Andre, by the way, for your documents - they are charming! And thank you for pointing this out to us -

Val ;-)

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On Oct 2, 2013, at 10:11 AM, Charles Butler <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

IF this does not work from a compatible program then the compatibility program of the major SignWriting programs need to all be made compatible. I know that this is a challenge, but making a new signwriting translator without a compatibility check seems a little futile. If the main database can't retrieve the words, then the point of Open Source is not being fulfilled. 

To do Open Source means that all output from a given input must be compatible to the central databank, in the case, SignBank, SignPuddle, and all of those others created. 

Is it not part of the spec of importing signs? Is there not a command to say "which of the following compatible programs are you using to import to SignPuddle?" "have you contact Steve Slevinski to ensure that the program will in fact import your signs in a form that is acceptable to the data retrieval function."

Else, it is a very large learning curve. 
 
Charles Butler
[log in to unmask]
240-764-5748
Clear writing moves business forward.


From: Stephen E Slevinski Jr <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Wednesday, October 2, 2013 1:03 PM
Subject: Re: Sign puddle online does not translate existing words


On 10/2/13 11:37 AM, André L wrote:
Hello,
 
Many of the words I entered in sign puddle using sign studio are not displayed in the translate feature.
Only the words are displayed without sign.
However, with a seach on the same words, the sign is displayed.
Hi Andre,

The translate feature works with individual signs that were created in SignMaker.

The translate feature does not work with sign texts that were created with SignText.

Looking at the "assis" entry:
http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle2.0/canvas.php?ui=1&sgn=47&sid=4400

    [log in to unmask]">

The sign is boxed and a lower font size.  This indicates it was created with SignText.  Under the "Source", you can see the "SignText data" links.  This sign will not work in the current translate.

Here is "assistant" in the same dictionary.

[log in to unmask]">

Notice that it is not boxed and a larger font size.  This indicates is was created with SignMaker.  Under the "Search.." links, you can see the "Sign data" links.  This sign will work in translate.


So that's the problem.  You say you created this with "sign studio".  Are you talking about Jonathan's SignWriter Studio?  Or did you use SignText?

The solution is to move the signs from the sign text area to individual signs.  I'm not sure the best way to do this.

How many entries are like this?

Regards,
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Tel USA: (347)875-8442
Skype: yojoduncan

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