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Hi Val,
On 10/10/2013 8:55 AM, Valerie Sutton wrote:
> SignWriting List
> October 10, 2013
>
> Hello Jonathan!
> This is very exciting indeed. If I understand this correctly, when 
> people enter new signs in the dictionary in SignWriter Studio, they 
> will be able to associate the sign with different Sign Lists…for 
> example, the sign for CHAIR could be in the Sign Lists for FURNITURE 
> and HOUSEHOLD. So each sign could belong to multiple Sign Lists. Then 
> the user chooses the Sign List FURNITURE, and the sign for CHAIR will 
> be listed there with other signs for furniture.
     Yes, that's right!!

> Then the user can print the Sign List. Can the PDF automatically place 
> a title at the top saying something like "Signs for Furniture in 
> _______Sign Language" , with page numbers?
Yes good idea!!! Thank you for the feedback.
>
> Can signs from SignPuddle be imported into the SignWriter Studio 
> dictionary?
Yes.
Create or open a SignWriter Studio File.
Click on File/Import
Choose the file previously saved from SignPuddle under the Export option.

Regards,

Jonathan
>
> Val ;-)
>
> --------
>
>
> On Oct 10, 2013, at 7:29 AM, Jonathan Duncan <[log in to unmask] 
> <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>     please feel free to give point of view and suggestions.
>>
>> Hello André
>>     This is a revised list of functionality for making technical 
>> dictionaries for printout from the entries in the current SignWriter 
>> Studio Dictionary from our emails off the list.  We could call these 
>> technical dictionaries "Sign Lists" or "Glossaries" or "Topics".  
>> Look forward to input from members on the list.
>>
>> Features for first version
>>
>>   * Create a new window to show the list of signs in for each "Sign
>>     List".
>>  *
>>   * Click on Add Sign will bring up the Dictionary which can be
>>     searched, then the signs selected to be added to the current
>>     "Sign List".
>>   * Sign Lists automatically saved to Dictionary file.
>>   * Can select paper size.
>>   * Print Layout
>>       o Two columns
>>       o Words (gloss) at the top of each entry in bold
>>       o SignWriting, with Illustration of what it is beside it.
>>       o Keep all entries together, not split across two pages.
>>       o Shrink SignWriting and Illustration if they don't fit the
>>         column width
>>       o Signs sorted by word (gloss)
>>       o Roman numeral page numbering
>>
>> Possible future features
>>
>>   * Screen paging. The complete list would not be loaded, at most 100
>>     at a time to not overload the memory.
>>   * In the Dictionary add a place for full spoken language description.
>>   * Option to printout or not description
>>   * Option to printout secondary language also (bilingual option
>>     example English and French along with the sign)
>>   * Option to split output into several files. There may be a problem
>>     with PDF: with 10 signs per page we have 800 pages of ASL
>>     dictionary full of drawings and several pictures.  Low resolution
>>     sign images are required.  It may be problematic to load 800
>>     pages in adobe to see 1 single word... Possibly split the
>>     dictionary in 5 or 24 documents.
>>   * Extra pages either make them or option to include pre-made pages
>>     in PDF.
>>       o The user should be able to create a cover page with text of
>>         several lines, and image, several line.
>>       o Second page, the editor name, the date, copyright to Valerie
>>         and you and pointer to internet sites.
>>       o Several pages of introduction text prior to the dictionary
>>         itself.
>>   * Possible a table of content or pointers to jump to a chosen
>>     letter (table of content being undefined until the page count is
>>     completed).
>>   * Possibly the first word of each page in the top left corner to
>>     browse fast through a paper document.
>>   * Sort signs by Symbol
>>
>> Let me know your thoughts and suggestions.
>>
>> Thanks
>> Jonathan
>>
>> On 10/4/2013 10:26 AM, André L wrote:
>>> Hello Duncan,
>>>
>>> thank you for your interest in supporting dictionary generation with 
>>> SignWriter Studio.  I like this software a lot.
>>>
>>> This is my main interest in sign writing.  I whish to support access 
>>> to rich vocabulary for interpreters, parents or hearing educator to 
>>> improve the quality of the communication with deaf people.  The 
>>> second aspect is to develop highly technical dictionaries for 
>>> students and interpreters to avoid re-inventing custom signs all the 
>>> time.
>>>
>>> I am a software tester (13 years of experience).  Do you want to 
>>> discuss specifications, test case suite...  The user guide could be 
>>> a starting point...
>>>
>>> It will be important to be able to exclude signs or words from such 
>>> dictionary ( in LSQ sign puddle we have plenty of plural and feminin 
>>> version of the same word and conjugated verbs).
>>>
>>>
>>> André Lemyre
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2013 09:01:52 -0600
>>> From: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: Re: Creating a dictionnary
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>
>>> Hi André,
>>>     Way back I wrote a program called ASL List that did exactly what 
>>> you want but it was limited it only had so many signs.  So I decided 
>>> to and SignWriting to it and then came about SignWriter Studio.
>>>
>>> Presently that feature isn't working but I will work on that next 
>>> now that someone else is also interested!!!
>>>
>>> Jonathan
>>>
>>> On 10/2/2013 7:09 PM, André L wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>      Hello Valerie,
>>>     I would like to know how to create a paper dictionary (like a
>>>     book) by importing ALL LSQ signs from sign puddle.  I could show
>>>     that to collegue students, interpreters and use it myself.
>>>
>>>     Also, can we develop a technical dictionary (like for a student
>>>     electrician) that will also be part of the main dictionary?
>>>     Would there be a way to gather a pdf subset of the
>>>     main dictionary that the student could share with several
>>>     interpreters working with him-her?
>>>
>>>     André Lemyre
>>>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>     Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2013 17:30:46 -0700
>>>     From: [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>     Subject: Re: Sign puddle online does not translate existing words
>>>     To: [log in to unmask]
>>>     <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>
>>>     SignWriting List
>>>     October 2, 2013
>>>
>>>     Hello Andre, and Andre, Steve and Jonathan!
>>>
>>>     So ….we have some wonderful software that needs to be better
>>>     coordinated - but both programs by themselves work well. Right
>>>     now, Steve needs to complete the new SinPuddle 3 and get it
>>>     uploaded, because it also contains new features that everyone
>>>     wants, and it has taken longer than expected to complete the
>>>     software…
>>>
>>>     Regarding creating your own dictionaries, there is not only
>>>     SignWriter Studio, but also the PersonalPuddle, and Private Web
>>>     Puddles, and you can also use SignPuddle Online and label your
>>>     signs as yours in the Source and those signs could always be
>>>     transferred to SignWriter Studio maybe? can one reverse the
>>>     process? - ha! In time, all these programs will work well
>>>     together I am sure…both Jonathan and Steve work for very little
>>>     pay and are working hard to make the programs work well -
>>>
>>>     So for now, I would either use the workaround that Jonathan
>>>     suggested, or edit the signs in SignText, not SignMaker… let me
>>>     test this myself - I am sorry I have not done that yet -
>>>
>>>     SignBank would not work with this because it has not been
>>>     updated for years but I want to update it in the future -
>>>
>>>     Val ;-)
>>>
>>>     ----
>>>
>>>
>>>     On Oct 2, 2013, at 5:20 PM, André L <[log in to unmask]
>>>     <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>         Hello Jonathan,
>>>
>>>         thank you for the work around.
>>>         I will try it this weekend.
>>>         I will try to contact Steve to assist me because I have over
>>>         a hundred signs to process.
>>>         I have many more signs in draft in SignWriter studio.
>>>
>>>         Also, I tried sign bank 85 but I could never upload the
>>>         Québec Sign language files I copied from Sign puddle, so I
>>>         gave up.   I would have like to build a dictionnary.
>>>
>>>
>>>         André Lemyre
>>>         ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>         Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2013 16:29:30 -0600
>>>         From:[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>         Subject: Re: Sign puddle online does not translate existing
>>>         words
>>>         To:[log in to unmask]
>>>         <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>
>>>         Hi Andre,
>>>            When exporting from SignWriter Studio to Sign Puddle
>>>         there is no way to directly to a SignMaker entry. This is a
>>>         limitation of SignPuddle. I have run into this limitation
>>>         myself personally trying to add and modify sign to the
>>>         puddle from SignWriter Studio.  SignPuddle doesn't yet have
>>>         adequate import/export or synching capabilities.   I have
>>>         written to Steve about it but he hasn't been able to make it
>>>         a priority yet.
>>>         If you just have a few signs then this is they way to do it.
>>>
>>>          1. In SignWriter Studio when positioned on the sign, click
>>>             Edit/Copy/Copy Sign to Sign Puddle or press Ctrl-Alt-C.
>>>             It shows the sign in SignPuddle in your browser.
>>>          2. Click on the puddle you want to save to.
>>>          3. In Terms type "temp"
>>>          4. Click Add
>>>          5. Click Copy Sign From SignText
>>>          6. Click Copy Sign
>>>          7. Click on SignPuddle you want to save to
>>>          8. In Terms type in the term for the sign
>>>          9. Click Add
>>>         10. Click on Search by Words or Search by Signs
>>>         11. In Terms and Titles type "temp"
>>>         12. Click on temp
>>>         13. Click Delete Entry
>>>         14. Click Delete Entry
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>         Otherwise you might ask Steve if you export to an SPML file
>>>         if he can add them for you.
>>>
>>>         I hope his helps
>>>
>>>         Regards,
>>>         Jonathan
>>>
>>>         On 10/2/2013 11:41 AM, Valerie Sutton wrote:
>>>
>>>             SignWriting List
>>>             October 2, 2013
>>>
>>>             Andre, Steve, Charles and Jonathan -
>>>
>>>             No worries everyone. Thank you for your messages. And
>>>             thank you for bringing this issue up, which as far as I
>>>             know, from my experience, is specific between the two
>>>             programs: SignWriter Studio and SignPuddle. I noticed
>>>             this issue myself a long time ago and did mention it
>>>             once to Jonathan, but there is so much to do it got
>>>             sidetracked. It seems that exporting signs from the
>>>             SignWriter Studio dictionary end up as SignText in
>>>             SignPuddle instead of dictionary entries…so the signs
>>>             are not made with SignMaker, but instead with SignWriter
>>>             Studio's dictionary, but they need to end up as the
>>>             equivalent to signs made with SignMaker… not as SignText
>>>             …so we need both Jonathan's and Steve's help with this one -
>>>
>>>             Thank you, Andre, by the way, for your documents - they
>>>             are charming! And thank you for pointing this out to us -
>>>
>>>             Val ;-)
>>>
>>>             --------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>             On Oct 2, 2013, at 10:11 AM, Charles Butler
>>>             <[log in to unmask]
>>>             <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>>>
>>>                 IF this does not work from a compatible program then
>>>                 the compatibility program of the major SignWriting
>>>                 programs need to all be made compatible. I know that
>>>                 this is a challenge, but making a new signwriting
>>>                 translator without a compatibility check seems a
>>>                 little futile. If the main database can't retrieve
>>>                 the words, then the point of Open Source is not
>>>                 being fulfilled.
>>>
>>>                 To do Open Source means that all output from a given
>>>                 input must be compatible to the central databank, in
>>>                 the case, SignBank, SignPuddle, and all of those
>>>                 others created.
>>>
>>>                 Is it not part of the spec of importing signs? Is
>>>                 there not a command to say "which of the following
>>>                 compatible programs are you using to import to
>>>                 SignPuddle?" "have you contact Steve Slevinski to
>>>                 ensure that the program will in fact import your
>>>                 signs in a form that is acceptable to the data
>>>                 retrieval function."
>>>
>>>                 Else, it is a very large learning curve.
>>>                 Charles Butler
>>>                 [log in to unmask]
>>>                 <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>                 240-764-5748
>>>                 Clear writing moves business forward.
>>>
>>>                 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>                 *From:*Stephen E Slevinski Jr <[log in to unmask]
>>>                 <mailto:[log in to unmask]>>
>>>                 *To:*[log in to unmask]
>>>                 <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>                 *Sent:*Wednesday, October 2, 2013 1:03 PM
>>>                 *Subject:*Re: Sign puddle online does not translate
>>>                 existing words
>>>
>>>
>>>                 On 10/2/13 11:37 AM, André L wrote:
>>>
>>>                     Hello,
>>>
>>>                     Many of the words I entered in sign puddle using
>>>                     sign studio are not displayed in the translate
>>>                     feature.
>>>                     Only the words are displayed without sign.
>>>                     However, with a seach on the same words, the
>>>                     sign is displayed.
>>>
>>>                 Hi Andre,
>>>
>>>                 The translate feature works with individual signs
>>>                 that were created in SignMaker.
>>>
>>>                 The translate feature does not work with sign texts
>>>                 that were created with SignText.
>>>
>>>                 Looking at the "assis" entry:
>>>                 http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle2.0/canvas.php?ui=1&sgn=47&sid=4400
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>                 The sign is boxed and a lower font size.  This
>>>                 indicates it was created with SignText. Under the
>>>                 "Source", you can see the "SignText data" links.
>>>                 This sign will not work in the current translate.
>>>
>>>                 Here is "assistant" in the same dictionary.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>                 Notice that it is not boxed and a larger font size.
>>>                 This indicates is was created with SignMaker. Under
>>>                 the "Search.." links, you can see the "Sign data"
>>>                 links. This sign will work in translate.
>>>
>>>
>>>                 So that's the problem.  You say you created this
>>>                 with "sign studio".  Are you talking about
>>>                 Jonathan's SignWriter Studio?  Or did you use SignText?
>>>
>>>                 The solution is to move the signs from the sign text
>>>                 area to individual signs.  I'm not sure the best way
>>>                 to do this.
>>>
>>>                 How many entries are like this?
>>>
>>>                 Regards,
>>>                 ________________________________________________
>>>                 SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>                 Valerie Sutton SignWriting List
>>>                 [log in to unmask]
>>>                 <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>                 Post Messages to the SignWriting
>>>                 List:[log in to unmask]
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>>>
>>>                 ________________________________________________
>>>
>>>                 SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>                 Valerie Sutton SignWriting List
>>>                 [log in to unmask]
>>>                 <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>                 Post Messages to the SignWriting
>>>                 List:[log in to unmask]
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>>>
>>>
>>>             ________________________________________________
>>>             SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>             Valerie Sutton SignWriting List
>>>             [log in to unmask]
>>>             <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>             Post Messages to the SignWriting
>>>             List:[log in to unmask]
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>>>
>>>         --
>>>         email:[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>         [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>         Cel Honduras: (504)3141-1171
>>>         Tel USA: (347)875-8442
>>>         Skype: yojoduncan
>>>
>>>         SignWriter Studio <http://www.signwriterstudio.com/>
>>>         ________________________________________________
>>>         SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>         Valerie Sutton SignWriting List
>>>         [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>         Post Messages to the SignWriting
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>>>         ________________________________________________
>>>         SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>         Valerie Sutton SignWriting List
>>>         [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>         Post Messages to the SignWriting
>>>         List:[log in to unmask]
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>>>
>>>     ________________________________________________ SIGNWRITING
>>>     LIST INFORMATION
>>>     Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator [log in to unmask]
>>>     <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
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>>>     ________________________________________________
>>>     SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>     Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator [log in to unmask]
>>>     <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
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>>>
>>> -- 
>>> email: [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>> [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>> Cel Honduras: (504)3141-1171
>>> Tel USA: (347)875-8442
>>> Skype: yojoduncan
>>>
>>> SignWriter Studio <http://www.signwriterstudio.com/>
>>> ________________________________________________
>>>
>>> SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>
>>> Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator [log in to unmask]
>>>
>>> Post Messages to the SignWriting List: 
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>>>
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>>> ________________________________________________
>>>
>>> SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>
>>> Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator [log in to unmask]
>>>
>>> Post Messages to the SignWriting List: 
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>>>
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>>
>> -- 
>>
>> email: [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>> [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>> Cel Honduras: (504)3141-1171
>> Tel USA: (347)875-8442
>> Skype: yojoduncan
>>
>> SignWriter Studio <http://www.signwriterstudio.com/>
>>
>> ________________________________________________
>>
>> SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>
>> Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator [log in to unmask] 
>> <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>
>> Post Messages to the SignWriting List: 
>> [log in to unmask] 
>> <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>
>> SignWriting List Archives & Home Page 
>> http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist
>>
>> Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages 
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>>
>
> ________________________________________________
>
> SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>
> Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator [log in to unmask]
>
> Post Messages to the SignWriting List: [log in to unmask]
>
> SignWriting List Archives & Home Page 
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>
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>

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Tel USA: (347)875-8442
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SignWriter Studio <http://www.signwriterstudio.com/>


________________________________________________


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Valerie Sutton
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