SignWriting List
January 11, 2011

Hello Stefan and everyone...
Thank you for this response. It is always great to get your feedback...which is excellent...

Actually in this case, I feel it would be impossible to have that mean a Hip Line, since the rule is, if you want a sign to be close to the Hip Line you must have two lines...one for the Shoulder and one for the Hip, and the two lines for the Shoulder and Hip are close together, and must be written as a unit. Hip and Shoulder Line are one symbol in the ISWA, with a smaller space for the Torso than you see in the compound sign below...







So for that sign to be "under the hip" it would be required that both the Shoulder Line and the Hip Line were written with a smaller space for the torso, and the hand movement would be only under the Hip LIne:









I think you are referring to the vertical nature of compound signs? There is a space between the two Shoulder Lines in the compound sign (or 2-part sign), that is larger than the space is for the Torso. That is why I did not think of that being a confusion. But I am glad you told me that could be confusing for others...

I write compound signs going down vertically, because most of our documents are written in vertical columns here...and a white space is enough to make it clear that they are two parts to a sign...at least it seems to be readable to me...

But your point gives importance to my actual feelings  - I prefer using the Neck Symbol because it is clearer, I think, in these examples.  So indirectly you have made my point, that the Neck Symbol is so visual and so obvious, that the Shoulder Lines are not needed some of the time - in this case, I would use the Neck Symbols, especially if you feel that the two Shoulder Lines in the sign for BABDOR can be mis-read -

Let's use the Neck Symbol more for these kinds of signs, is my suggestion...it is better for the ASL sign too, I think...














On Jan 11, 2011, at 1:24 PM, Stefan Wöhrmann wrote:

> Hi Valerie, 
> 
> great to see new E-lessons - -- I love to study all your instructions,
> spellings, suggestions, ... 
> 
> In this case - I am afraid  - the sign might be easily misinterpreted as
> first part signing in height of the shoulder and second part down below the
> hip!!  - smile - Know what I mean? 
> 
> All the best 
> 
> Stefan ;-) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: SignWriting List: Read and Write Sign Languages
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Im Auftrag von Valerie Sutton
> Gesendet: Dienstag, 11. Januar 2011 22:07
> An: [log in to unmask]
> Betreff: SW E-Lesson 0097: Neck and Shoulders
> 
> SignWriting List
> January 11, 2011
> 
> New SignWriting E-Lesson Posted: Question 0097
> http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/elessons/less083.html
> 
> 
> QUESTION 0097
> 
> Contact on the NECK and SHOULDERS
> How do we write a movement that is relating to the lower part of the neck?
> Do I use the Shoulder Line and place the hands on top of the Shoulder Line?
> The movement looks too low on the chest when I write it that way, and the
> hands cover up the Shoulder Line and it is hard to read the hands on top of
> the Shoulders...
> 
> 
> ANSWER 0097
> 
> The Neck Symbol is attached to the circle for the Head:
>